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CBS Hypes Gouging, NBC Focuses on Fears of Greens & ABC Rejects Liberal Premises
Posted by Brent Baker on April 25, 2006 - 21:46.
The broadcast network evening shows delivered a variety of spins Tuesday night on the price of gas, with CBS raising a “windfall tax on big oil” and featuring an in-studio segment with left-wing busybody Eliot Spitzer, the Attorney General of New York, about price gouging and NBC's Brian Williams worried about the concerns of those want a “greener America.” ABC's Betsy Stark rejected the price-gouging charge and while CBS insisted that eliminating environmental regulations would have little effect, Stark reported such a suspension would have an immediate impact.

CBS Evening News anchor Russ Mitchell asked White House reporter Jim Axelrod about the idea of "slapping a windfall tax on big oil companies for these record profits that they're making?" Mitchell then turned to Spitzer: "As a consumer, it seems like it's the wild West. How easy is it for a gas station, for an oil company to just jack up the price of gas?" NBC's Williams set up a story on President Bush's proposals by citing how “advocates for a greener America” are “seeing red over what they see as a quickly degrading environment." Williams soon asked David Gergen "what are the chances” that the high prices will lead the U.S. to now move from a “carbon based society to one that's more green?" Gergen replied: "Well, one hopes that's the case...” (Transcripts follow.)

World News Tonight ran a “Reality Check” in which Betsy Stark noted that while “the President's pledge to crack down on price gouging may help quiet critics who believe the market is being manipulated,” the “reality is the industry is often accused and almost never found guilty."

CBS's Jim Axelrod dismissed the impact of environmental rules that regulate the formulation of gasoline: "The President also wants certain environmental regulations to be suspended so that more gas can be used by more states interchangeably. Again, the idea is to pump up the supply. A few more drops headed to the barrel maybe, but really nothing's going to bring prices down anytime soon." In contrast, Stark asserted: "What could impact prices almost immediately is a suspension of environmental regulations. The reality here is that waiving the elaborate rules on summertime blends will likely push supplies up and prices down."

Some highlights from Tuesday, April 25 gas price stories run on the broadcast network evening newscasts, gathered with the help of the MRC's Brad Wilmouth:

CBS Evening News. Jim Axelrod concluded from the White House:


"The President also wants certain environmental regulations to be suspended so that more gas can be used by more states interchangeably. Again, the idea is to pump up the supply. A few more drops headed to the barrel maybe, but really nothing's going to bring prices down anytime soon, Russ."

Russ Mitchell then tossed leading and softball questions to his featured guest at the anchor desk, left-wing activist Eliot Spitzer, New York's Attorney General:

"And joining me is a man who's keeping a close watch on the rise in gas prices, the Attorney General of the state of New York, Eliot Spitzer, who's also a candidate for the Democratic nomination for governor. Attorney General, thanks for joining us today."

Attorney General Eliot Spitzer (D-NY): "My pleasure."

Mitchell: "As a consumer, it seems like it's the wild West. How easy is it for a gas station, for an oil company to just jack up the price of gas?"

Spitzer: "Very easy. And what we found after Katrina was that prices were going through the roof. Nobody was respectful of their legal obligation to abide by basic decency and New York state law that prohibits them from excessive price increases at a moment of dislocation such as a hurricane such as Katrina. And so it was very, very disturbing what we saw."

Mitchell: "You are suing several gas stations in the state of New York right now. And in your mind, how did they break the law?"

Spitzer: "They broke the law by increasing the price inordinately and outrageously compared to what they had to pay for it. In other words, people will say, 'Well, don't they pay more?' Yes, they paid more, but they doubled or tripled their profit margin at a time when there was a dislocation in the market from a hurricane. That was illegal and wrong."

Mitchell: "As consumers, of course, most of us have to buy gasoline. What would you advise us to do. What can we do to make this better?"

Spitzer: "Any consumer should comparison shop. The reality is you can go to four or five different gas stations, one of them will have a lower price. And if you go to that station with a lower price over time, that will help drive the price down. But realistically, as individual consumers, we cannot affect the global market or even the local market. We are the pawns in this battle."

Mitchell: "We're stuck."

Spitzer: "We are stuck."

Mitchell: "New York Attorney General Eliot Spitzer, thanks for joining us."

Spitzer: "Thank you very much."

NBC Nightly News. Brian Williams led:


"Good evening. While a nation of drivers and consumers does a slow burn over yet another sudden spike in the price of gas and with advocates for a greener America seeing red over what they see as a quickly degrading environment, today President Bush took on the topic of energy to mixed reviews. Specifically, his plans to divert oil from the nation's strategic oil reserve. The President wants to suspend some environmental rules on what kind of gas can be burned in cars during the summer. He has the government looking for price gouging and the President wants Congress to take away tax breaks from oil companies, some of which he just signed into law as part of the energy bill. It is a lot of ground to cover and it's a big and urgent issue in this country and we have it covered tonight."
After David Gregory, Williams brought aboard David Gergen, of U.S. News and Harvard University, from Boston. Gregory's second of two questions:

"David, in the bigger picture sense, what are the chances, do you think, that we will look back on this period right now and say that in retrospect it was a period of transition for the United States from what's been called a carbon based society to one that's more green?"

David Gergen: "Well, one hopes that's the case, Brian, but we've had these kind of transition periods before and we've unfortunately we've taken an exit, an off ramp and never kept going. I was back in the White House in the early 1970s writing speeches about energy independence. We've been talking about this for over twenty years without succeeding. It's like school reform without true comprehensive reform. In this case, the coming together of a terrorism threat, the high prices of oil, and the looming sense that climate change really could be irreversible and extraordinarily dangerous, maybe this is the time when we'll break through and have a real political break through. But it's too early to say."

ABC's World News Tonight. Following Martha Raddatz on Bush's proposals, anchor Elizabeth Vargas set up the newscast's second story of the night on gas prices:


"How much relief the President's proposals may eventually give to motorists filling up at the pump remains to be seen. But the oil markets reacted immediately to his speech. Crude oil prices fell to $72.88 a barrel, down 45 cents from yesterday. ABC's Betsy Stark has a 'Reality Check.'"

Betsy Stark: "The President's pledge to crack down on price gouging may help quiet critics who believe the market is being manipulated. But the reality is the industry is often accused and almost never found guilty."

Robin West, PFC Energy: "I don't think anyone's going to find anything. I think it just makes everyone feel better."

Stark: "Mr. Bush talked about getting prices down by promoting fuel efficiency, driving slower and driving less. But the reality is that will only lower prices if Americans change their behavior en masse."

West: "They like big, comfortable, heavy, inefficient cars to drive around in. That's fine. That's their choice. But they should realize there are consequences of that choice, and the consequence is higher prices."

Stark: "What could impact prices almost immediately is a suspension of environmental regulations. The reality here is that waiving the elaborate rules on summertime blends will likely push supplies up and prices down."

Fadel Gheit, Oppenheimer and Company energy analyst: "I would say it will bring gasoline prices down substantially within, say, two to three weeks. I would say by 20 cents at least, or even more."

Stark: "Over the long term, the President's proposal to develop alternative fuels, including hydrogen power and ethanol, could provide relief at the pump. And so could his plan to increase domestic supplies. But the reality is any relief from either of those proposals is probably years away."

Gheit: "It is not going to have any impact on gasoline prices next year, or for the next five or even ten years."

Stark: "As for Mr. Bush's plan to stop filling the strategic petroleum reserve for the summer, the reality is it may sound like a big deal, but it's really just a drop in the bucket."

West, PFC Energy: "It's a sensible step to take. There's nothing wrong with doing this. But this isn't a silver bullet."

Stark: "We heard that again and again today. No silver bullets, no quick fixes. Analysts say it's taken 25 years to get into this mess. And it's going to take years to get out of it. Probably not what Americans want to hear."

Vargas: "I was just going to say that's not what they're looking to hear right now. All right. Thanks, Betsy."

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Categories: Brian Williams | CBS Evening News | Jim Axelrod | NBC Nightly News | Oil & Gas Prices | Russ Mitchell | World News Tonight


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Montana lyons Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:58
http://volcano.und.edu/vwdocs/frequent_questions/top_101/Effects/Effects4.html



Never would I expect Karl Rove to become a hero in the right wing nerd circles of america especially after McCarthy lived out his days in infamy and disgrace. Montana Lyons

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:46
yeah, sure... Uh, huh.

Just like a liberal... Spin, evade, obsfucate, and ignore the SCIENCE when it doesn't fit your "agenda."

Oh, and you're STILL a plagiarist:

http://newsbusters.org/node/5063

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Montana lyons Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:43
When there is someone intelligent , preferably a true conservative with a little maturity, Ill glady converse with them. I guess zap has gone to bed.

Montana Lyons reminds me of a radical lefist who lived next door to me, always ranting about "Bush" and "repulicans." He finally shot himself in the mouth with a shotgun.

I guess that I can empathize with him. Living next to an obsessed immature loon would drive anyone mad!



Never would I expect Karl Rove to become a hero in the right wing nerd circles of america especially after McCarthy lived out his days in infamy and disgrace. Montana Lyons

reply »

Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:40
yes Nathan! Very reasoned, and well thought-out position. if only others could think as reasonibly and rationally as you. Unfortunately, many foaming-at-the-mouth leftists are obsessed with practicing the "politics of fear," on the environment.

Very sad, really.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:37
Montana Lyons reminds me of a radical lefist who lived next door to me, always ranting about "Bush" and "repulicans." He finally shot himself in the mouth with a shotgun. Really sad, actually. must be why people like Montana Lyons are so unhappy with themselves: They have to go around inventing "conspiracies" like "Laura Bush is a a Murderer!" HA!

Too danm funny!

And if you ANYTHING about environmental research (which you OBVIOUSLY don't), you would know there is typically a several year time gap in information (typically between 5-7 years before all world wide data is collected). So the LATEST information we have is from the mid to late 1990s. You really ARE showing your IGNORANCE of scientific research. tsk...tsk..

ha!

So you are IGNORANTLY asking for something "in this century" (the 2000s) that scientists don't even HAVE yet.

But the DATA (from as recently as 1997) confirms MY position that volcanoes put out more global emissions than man, period.

Maybe YOU should have played MORE chess. I would have perhaps kept you from PLAGIARIZING the work of others!

HA!

http://newsbusters.org/node/5063

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Montana lyons Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:32
this immature little boy that reminds me so much of one of my chess players that gets so excited when I help advise him on the game and he checkmates me. I then let him feel better when he brags to everyone at school.

chess is great for the self esteem of students with learning disabilities. It helps them focus and actually behave better. You should take up chess Karl. You seem to suffer from many insecurities and issues. Were you abused in your recent childhood? I am curious why you have this obsession with me? Have you thought about getting help and medication?



Never would I expect Karl Rove to become a hero in the right wing nerd circles of america especially after McCarthy lived out his days in infamy and disgrace. Montana Lyons

reply »

Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:28
Exacty futbol: I couldn't have said it better myself!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:27
Nathan....well said!!!!

Obviously we care, but we don't make it an obssesion and none of us believe that a human life is worth protecting the environment like many enviromentalists do.


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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:25
Uh, you needed to read the SOURCES page at the bottom sport. if you WOULD HAVE, you would HAVE FOUND this:

Sources of Information (MOST FROM THE 1990s):

Andreae M.O., 1990, Ocean-atmosphere interaction in the global biogeochemical sulfur cycle: Marine Chemistry, v. 30: 1-29.

Andres, R.J., and Kasgnoc, A.D., Global Emissions Inventory Activity, 1997, Global Emissions Inventory Activity: Time-Averaged Inventory of Volcanic Sulfur Emissions

Barnes, Ivan, Irwin, W.P., and White, D.E., 1978, Global distribution of carbon dioxide discrages, and major zones of seismicity: U.S. Geological Survey Water Resources Investigation 78-79, Open-File Report, 12 p.

Bates, T.S., Lamb, B.K., Guenther, A., Dignon, J., Stoiber, R.E., 1992, Sulfur emissions to the atmosphere from natural sources. Journal of Atmospheric Chemistry 14:315-337.

Buat-Menard, P., and Arnold, M., 1978, The heavy metal chemistry of atmospheric particulate matter emitted by Mount Etna volcano: Geophysical Research Letters, v. 5, p. 245.

Cadle, R.D., 1980, A comparison of volcanic with other fluxes of atmospheric trace gas constituents: Reviews of Geophysics and Space Physics, v. 18, p. 746-752.

Tamar Elias, written communication, , 28 May 1997.

Gerlach, T.M., 1991, Present-day CO2 emissions from volcanoes: Transactions of the American Geophysical Union (EOS), v. 72, p. 249, and 254-255.

Gerlach, T.M., 1991, Etna's Greenhouse Pump: Nature, 351, p. 352-353.

Gerlach, T.M., 1990, Natural Sources of Greenhouse gases: CO2 emissions from volcanoes. Geothermal Resources Council Transactions, vol. 14, part I, pp. 639-641,

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

And if you ANYTHING about environmental research (which you OBVIOUSLY don't), you would know there is typically a several year time gap in information (typically between 5-7 years before all world wide data is collected). So the LATEST information we have is from the mid to late 1990s.

ha!

LOL!

Oh, and you're still a PLAGIARIST!

http://newsbusters.org/node/5063

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:25
karl....no, not the hairspray!! please....anything else but the hairspray!
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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:23
Tom/Zapata, I suppose...

I just find it amusing when I hear the words "politics of fear" being used by the left and all the left does is talk doom and gloom and use scare tactics to try to get people to vote for them.....

I mean all they do is say, "fear Bush he is the end of America as we know it, fear republicans, vote for us..." that is all they do....

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Montana lyons Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:22
with man mane sources! tdf

hmmm, no author?? , sources very out of date...lets find something this century , Karl ...tdf

neocons who fear scientists and edit the facts will use this as a standard refutation to pollution and global warming

it has a little more validity than intelligent design!


Never would I expect Karl Rove to become a hero in the right wing nerd circles of america especially after McCarthy lived out his days in infamy and disgrace. Montana Lyons

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:19
Well, it's like you just said, but they think that THEY'RE right and that BUSH is wrong.
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:17
As we have SCIENIFICALLY proven here today, the claims put out by the left about the environment ARE/HAVE been done in a MANIPULATIVE fashion.

The left is LYING about the environment, plain and simple.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:17
people? or do you mean leftists that hate this President and Conservatives at all cost?

Liberals complain about what they believe is scare tactics from the PResident, yet they use it themselves to push their own agenda....

still I see not difference? except that Bush is right and the left is wrong....but besides that, why does the left cry about it and then they use the same tactics that they say are bad for Conservatives to use?

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Nathan Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:16
Most of the conservatives I know do care about conservation and the environment. At the same time, they support energy proposals like drilling in ANWR because the benefits seemed to outweigh the marginal environmental effects.

As long as Al Gore is the face of "environmentalism" and as long as environmentalists come across as categorically anti-business, the movement is not going to attract many conservatives.

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:14
exactly....there are all kind of humane socities for animals, but God forbid if someone speaks about not aborting a human being......

I am sure that professor would love Hitler too.....some of these people are nutjobs!

and the fact still stands....the same people, the same crowd, the same political party that was predicting the end of the world by 1990 because of overpopulation is the same people that today are crying about the end of the world because we don't care about the environemnt........

zapata....cry wolf too many times and no one is going to believe you.



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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:14
HMMM... "mistrust of science"... And yet, Montana Lyons (plagiarism boy) couldn't even comment on THIS, which shows that volcanoes put out MUCH MORE global emissions than man mane sources:

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

yes, montana Lyons must have a "mistrust of science"

LOL1

Oh, and he is also a pLAGIARIST!:

http://newsbusters.org/node/5063

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:13
When environmentalists say scary things about the state of the environment, it's because they believe something scary is going on. People call bs on conservatives when they think it's being done in a manipulative fasion
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Montana lyons Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:11


That's all I'm saying too. It's a mystery to me why so many conservatives are hostile to environmentalism, I think it is part of their overall mistrust of science

the white house is sleeping with the major oil companies, the family has been tied to oil for decades. environmentalism and global warming is a threat to their livelihood . They know that there are much cleaner alternatives that could eventually put the oil companies out of business, but as long as they can charge for energy they have us by the cajones. Bush gave a huge tax break to oil companies and now he acts like hes on the side of the consumer!



Never would I expect Karl Rove to become a hero in the right wing nerd circles of america especially after McCarthy lived out his days in infamy and disgrace. Montana Lyons

reply »

Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:10
FUTBOL: Careful, or I'll tell my sister to use her can of HAIRSPRAY and DESTROY THE EARTH!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:10
oops.....yeah, those darn human whales....sorry about that

well Zapata/Tom, then you are lucky, I have ran into plenty of them in my short 30 year old life span.....and they are scary.

but honestly guy, why can you guys use fear to make peopel take action against what you believe is bad, but you guys scream havoc, if you believe a Conservative does the same thing?

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:09
http://newsbusters.org/node/5063

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:08
futbol: That is why the left wants "population control" (translation: abortion as a means of sex selection and population control).

Because, in the end, they DON'T value human life very much and believe human beings shouldn't even BE on the earth and have less of a right to exist than a Dolphin.

Just look at the loon University of Texas professor who recently said that the Earth would benefit if 3/4 of all humans would just DIE right away. Boy! Hitler would have LOVED this kooky leftist!

These people really have skewed priorities.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:05
"human whale", is that one of those human-animal hybrids that the President mentioned outlawing in the State of the Union Address? Just kidding, I know it was a typo, but ANYWAY, I've never met anyone in my entire life who thought that a whale was more valuable than a human.

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Montana lyons Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:04
Never would I expect Karl Rove to become a hero in the right wing nerd circles of america especially after McCarthy lived out his days in infamy and disgrace. Montana Lyons

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:03
well, why haven't the libbies demonstrated against the asteroid that they believe made earth less habital for the dinos?

and I believe you are mistaken, i have ran accross plenty of an environemntalist that believes that a human whale has more life value than a human being, adult or baby.....

and regardless, as usual, it is ok for libs to use scare tactics, but not for conservatives?

can you explain that liberals?

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:01
you have me rolling Karl!!

we come along and destroy it with hairspray....

earth has survived the worst the worst spaking it can give itself, space objects....but no, not us, well at least according to the libbies....

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 01:00
I AM sure. We'll be JUST FINE. Stop WORRYING so much!

Go out for a walk! have a beer!

Relax buddy! We are not "destroying the earth."

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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acaiguana Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:59
I think it has been clear for some time that these east coast seaboard types hate the wild west or any idea of it and associate only 'bad' things with the West and Texas in particular. So, you are right, it is weird, but normal for them.

Building refineries is a good idea, long overdue.

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:59
I don't think even the most extreme environmentalist is saying that humans will actually break the earth up into little pieces. I think that when people say "destroying" the earth, they mean making it less habitable for humans than it is now.
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:58
Exactly Futbol: The left is engaging in the "the politics of FEAR" on the environment.

Exactly. The earth has survived volcanoes, earth quakes, major disasters... and we come along and think we can "destroy" is with a CAN OF HAIRSPRAY!

HA!

lol!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:56
C'mon man... You GOTTA admit most environmentalists are pretty "out" there, to be "nice" about it..

and "environmentalism" has become BIG BUSINESS, with MAJOR BUCKS to be made by SCARING THE HELL out of people. At least BIG OIL is honest enough to sell a product that people REALLY NEED.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:56
well, think about it, if it is true that an asteroid hit earth and things got ugly here for a little bit.....we came after that...

SO PLANET EARTH SURVIVED, RIGHT?!


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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:51
just cus you can't read a basic CHART and realize YOU'RE wrong.

LOL!

http://newsbusters.org/node/5063

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:51
what has the earth survivied worse than us? You can say cataclysmic things like asteroid impacts, but those had catastophic effects like wiping out most life on earth, so I think we'd have to qualify what "survived" means.
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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:49
Karl...well said....

what I just don't is that Liberals cry with what they call President Bush scare tactics.....

but what are they doing with the environment, but trying to scare people, right?

so as usual, it is ok for Liberals to scare people into action, but not for a Conservative.

I also think that it is quite arrogant to believe that human can destroy earth when it has survived much worst than us.


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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:48
I've HAD some! it's YUMMY! not as yummy as some BIG OIL sprinkled on my breakfast cereal, mind you... but NOT BAD AT ALL!


“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:45
futbol: The "goom and doom" goes along with their "culture of victimization." They HAVE to convince people they are "victims" and that "we are destroying the world," otherwiese there is NO NEED for them, the "self appointed saviours" of the world.

These people really astounding in their arrogance and hubris.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:44
I don't see how you can reduce the entire environmental movement to some fringe groups burning lots of SUV's. That's like saying all conservative Christians are snake handlers drinking strychnine (that's probably spelled wrong)
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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:41
I see that....and the sad thing is that they don't see the errors of their ways.....

they don't want trees to be cut....but if youd on't cut trees as it happened under the Clinton administration, terrible forrest fires cost Ameicans millions upon millions of dollars and more trees and forrests are destroyed than if trees would have been cut down....

natural pollution is greater than man made....

burning a lot of SUVs causes way more pollution than letting all of those SUVs run their life...

and these are the same group thinkers that in the 1960s assured the world that by 1990 it would all be over do to over popullation.....what happened guys?

how can we believe you again about your doom and gloom?

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:41
wELL, yeah, but it WAS the Russians, who are notorious for shoddy work. I really don't see why people are so afraid of nuclear power...

Naaa... even WITH Chernobyl and Union Carbide, the environment still did OK...

Short of world wide nuclear war, there is little we can to to "destroy the environment," even if we TRIED.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:38
is this as real as the world coming to an end in 1990 do to over population?

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:38
futbol: The "Chicken Littles" are out in force tonight!

The SKY IS FALLING! The SKY IS FAAAALING!!!

LOL!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:38
I believe that's where the term "ugly American" comes from.
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:37
I don't care WHAT people do... As long as I have MY SUV and MY BIG OIL!

Whooo-peeee!!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:36
My answer? Uh, here ya go!:

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

TOTAL GLOBAL EMISSIONS... Not just "sulphur" or "chlorine."


“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:35
No, stupid liberals cause stupid people to be "afraid of destroying the environment!"

LOL!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:35
So you guys are saying no one should care about the environment. Pollute all you want because we can do anything we want to the environment and it'll be OK?
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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:34
are they as real as the world coming to an end in 1990 do to over popullation?

just checking guy

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:34
yeah, really. I'm actually very pro-nuclear power, but chernobly is a big reminder of how humans can impact our environment in a real way. Anyone who says, "Oh, the environment is indestructable, we can't hurt it" should pay more attention to things like Chernobyl, or Union Carbide in India.
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:34
And France currently covers its energy needs with 75% nuckear energy. Big whoop.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:34
"Chlorine from natural sources is soluble, and so it gets rained out of the lower atmosphere," the journal Science explained (6/11/93). "CFCs, in contrast, are insoluble and inert and thus make it to the stratosphere to release their chlorine." Science also noted that chlorine found in the stratosphere-- where it can eat away at Earth's protective ozone layer--is always found with other byproducts of CFCs, and not with the byproducts of natural chlorine sources. "Ozone depletion is real, as certain as Neil Armstrong's landing on the moon," Dr. Sherwood Rowland, an atmospheric chemist at the University of California at Irvine, told Extra!. "Natural causes of ozone depletion are not significant."
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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:33
oh, they were wrong about the time table, eh?

please.....nice excuse....

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:33
Who CARES about that? I want my BIG OIL and my SUV!


“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:32
pUH-LEEZE. "Fair" is a left-wing FRONT group that only reports informatoin that tilts left...

I notice you haven't commented on the chart I posted:

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:31
So maybe they were wrong about the timetable, but these are REAL concerns that someone should be thinking about, if not you guys.
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:31
Just becuae you lack the basic ability to LOOK AT A CHART and realize that what I've said is TRUE.

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:30
Here are some people that care about Chernobyl's long-lasting effects... http://www.pixelpress.org/chernobyl/screen5.html
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:29
Look at the chart, and READ 'EM AND WEEP, sport!

IT'S not jus "sulfur"... it's about TOTAL GLOBAL EMISSIONS...

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:29
mistrust of science?

no Zapata/Tom, the fact is that the same crowd that is screaming doom and gloom about the environemnt is the one that promised all of us in the 1960s that by 1990 the world would be over thanks to over population......

why should we trust the same crowd that lied to us about over population, get it?

and balboa it is not about hypocrites?

i mean if the environment was such a big deal and it is obvious that you, zapata and others voted for John Kerry, why would you vote for a hypocrite when it comes to the environment?

remeber Kerry while in Detroit owned SUVs, but when he went to another state he didn't own SUVs...

or how about those environmentalist that care so much about the environment that they burn car lots full of SUVs and Hummers.....

tell me which one would produce more pollution, burning a lot full of SUVs, you know burning all the plastic parts, tires, etc, or letting the SUV run its life course?

and don't forget, why believe teh same crowd that promise us the end of the world by 1990 do to over population?

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:27
I see trying to talk to you is as much a waste of time as ever, have a nice night.
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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:27
and you may not like FAIR, but the article sites a non-partisan journal for its info.
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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:26
So you agree that according to your link, humans put out 87% of Sulfur released into the atmosphere compared to 13% released by volcanoes, right? So in the matter of sulfur released into the air, man contributes MUCH more than volcanoes, yes?
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:26
No, YOU AGREE that (based on the chart) VOLCANOES put out MUCH MORE global emissions (not just "sulfur") than other sources!

I LOVE IT when YOU agree with ME!

lol!

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:25
You know, I wish I could be as sure of myself as you guys are. I really do. But I'm living in the real world, where things can and do go wrong. I know that's not the way you guys like to think about things, unless it's a war. I don't know for sure if we're destroying the planet, or hurting it, but I'll keep my eyes and ears open because this is afterall the only planet we have.
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:25
Who CARES about "the health of our planet?" LET'S PART-AAAAY!!!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:24

Annual Average Global Emissions of HCl, HF, and HBr, in Tg


Source

HCl

HF

HBr

Volcanoes

7.8

0.4

0.078

Oceans

300

0.02

1

Coal combustion

1.8

0.18

0.08

Petroleum combustion

0.013


0.00036

Natural gas combustion

.0022



Data compiled by Cadle (1980). Most of the gases emitted by the ocean return to the oceans.

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:23
"FAIR"... pUH-LEEZE! A left-wing FRONT group.

not credible.

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:22
That's all I'm saying too. It's a mystery to me why so many conservatives are hostile to environmentalism, I think it is part of their overall mistrust of science.
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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:21
Ugh, we're not talking about people who are hypocrites. We're simply saying "What's wrong with being concerned about the health of our planet"
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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:21
So you agree that according to your link, humans put out 87% of Sulfur released into the atmosphere compared to 13% released by volcanoes, right?
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:21
Thanks futbol: The libbies are trying to make us feel "guilty" again!

LOL!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:20
tHAT'S sulfur ONLY SPORT!

tAKE A LOOK at the chart for TOTAL GAS EMISSIONS (HCI, HF, and HBr).


“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:19
good job Karl!!!!


and tom/zapata, there is something to lose, ask Kerry, Kennedy, Moore, Franken, etc who love, adore, to fly in private jet planes that pollute a million times more than an SUV!!!!


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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:18
http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=1895
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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:18
Yes, and bullets cause gunshot wounds! Stupid trees and stupid bullets!
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:18
No, let's use MORE NUKES... silly libs...afraid of nuclear energy...

OK, so some guy "fell asleep" at Chernobyl...

BIG DEAL!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:17
LOL, did you not read your own chart? It says:

"volcanoes release only 13% of the sulfur added to the atmosphere compared to anthropogenic sources...the bulk of the anthropogenic flux is located in the northern hemisphere..."

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:17
Nope! No "guilt trip" for me! THANKs for trying though!

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:16
You want SCIENCE? You can't HANDLE science! (In my best jack Nicolson imitation):

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:15
Don't want you to feel guilty. "Concerned" is more like it. Is it so horrible to be concerned? So that maybe your great grandchildren don't have to be?
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:15
http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

Take a look at the chart and READ 'EM and weep, sparky!

LOL!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:14
Ok silly. Here goes:

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/Gases/man.html

Look at the CHART, and READ 'EM and WEEP sparky!

LOL!

“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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futbolisgreat Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:14
we need to destroy all those volcanos that pollute a million times more than humans ever had so that libbies will be happy.....

geez, we need a campaign to get rid of all volcanoes

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Montana lyons Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:14
envirowackos think trees are good, they only cause forest fires!

neocon logic! tdf


Never would I expect Karl Rove to become a hero in the right wing nerd circles of america especially after McCarthy lived out his days in infamy and disgrace. Montana Lyons

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balboa Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:13
Yes, and this link says that volcanic emissions are not as harmful as man-made pollution because of the CFCs attached to the manmade chlorine, as opposed to natural occurrences. http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=1895
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Karl Rove Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:12
yES! But I will have my SUV, my BIG MAC, and my TV!

And I will be HAPPY!

LOL!

Sorry environmental "guilt trippers!" No making ME feel "guilty!"

time to PARRRRT-AAAAY!!!


“Yet, there is a difference between responsible criticism that aims for success, and defeatism that refuses to acknowledge anything but failure. Hindsight alone is not wisdom, and second-guessing is not a strategy.” - President Bush

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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:12
You never answered, what do you have to lose, when you can't afford to be wrong?
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Tom Custer Says:
April 26, 2006 - 00:11
Why is it that the party that advocates "intelligent design" be taught in public schools is all of the sudden concerned about scientific evidence when it comes to the environment?